Comments on: Discussion: Doggy Daycare Pros and Cons http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/ Jenna & Snickers Promote Humane Education and Responsible Dog Ownership Tue, 31 Jan 2012 14:02:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Janet http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-541 Janet Mon, 08 Jun 2009 23:48:17 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-541 LMAO! I remember that one cause someone asked me on flickr if a dog's tail had been pulled off! LMAO! I remember that one cause someone asked me on flickr if a dog’s tail had been pulled off!

]]> By: jenna http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-540 jenna Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:22:12 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-540 ALERT ALERT MISSING PHOTO CREDIT!! I'm a schmuck. :) That is definitely one of your photos from when you visited the NYC Shiba Meetup group and met me & Snick! ALERT ALERT
MISSING PHOTO CREDIT!!
I’m a schmuck. :) That is definitely one of your photos from when you visited the NYC Shiba Meetup group and met me & Snick!

]]> By: Janet http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-538 Janet Mon, 08 Jun 2009 21:55:48 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-538 Now that Dad is gone and the dogs are home alone, I've been thinking of having a dog walker come in ... but then I think I should just go home and do it myself! It's hard to tear myself away from work tho... hey, that picture looks familiar! :-) Now that Dad is gone and the dogs are home alone, I’ve been thinking of having a dog walker come in … but then I think I should just go home and do it myself! It’s hard to tear myself away from work tho…

hey, that picture looks familiar! :-)

]]> By: jenna http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-537 jenna Mon, 08 Jun 2009 04:43:05 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-537 Masako - Sounds like you have a great daycare for Winnie! With both the daycares we've used, I actually made sure they would NOT take Snickers outside the facility for a walk. I only trust a very, very few people to handle him on a leash. He holds it in daycare too though... the first thing he does when we walk out the door is pee. Hocomo - I can't even TELL you how happy it makes me when you talk about Chad enjoying daycare! Words don't suffice. prajantr - Chelsea and Kaiser have each other (and occasionally Dakota) plus they get to spend time with you and hubby. Sounds like they've got it made without daycare. :) Michelle - LOL, yes, you got a little off topic, but not entirely. All of the emotions and the "rules of engagement" that come into play with dogs in groups is an important part of the daycare conversation. The shifting population in daycare - and even more so in dog parks as you mentioned - makes it harder for dogs to sort all that out and settle into a hierarchy like they would in a more permanent grouping. Regarding the relationship between domestication and communication, Stanley Coren's book <a href="http://jennaandsnickers.com/2008/10/how-dogs-think/" rel="nofollow">How Dogs Think</a> discusses neoteny and language abilities in canines. Temple Grandin's latest book Animals Make Us Human does also apparently, but I haven't read it yet. Masako – Sounds like you have a great daycare for Winnie! With both the daycares we’ve used, I actually made sure they would NOT take Snickers outside the facility for a walk. I only trust a very, very few people to handle him on a leash. He holds it in daycare too though… the first thing he does when we walk out the door is pee.

Hocomo – I can’t even TELL you how happy it makes me when you talk about Chad enjoying daycare! Words don’t suffice.

prajantr – Chelsea and Kaiser have each other (and occasionally Dakota) plus they get to spend time with you and hubby. Sounds like they’ve got it made without daycare. :)

Michelle – LOL, yes, you got a little off topic, but not entirely. All of the emotions and the “rules of engagement” that come into play with dogs in groups is an important part of the daycare conversation. The shifting population in daycare – and even more so in dog parks as you mentioned – makes it harder for dogs to sort all that out and settle into a hierarchy like they would in a more permanent grouping.

Regarding the relationship between domestication and communication, Stanley Coren’s book How Dogs Think discusses neoteny and language abilities in canines. Temple Grandin’s latest book Animals Make Us Human does also apparently, but I haven’t read it yet.

]]> By: Michelle Keener http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-535 Michelle Keener Sat, 06 Jun 2009 16:23:09 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-535 I think we sometimes confuse aggression, dominance, and normal dog corrective behavior because we can't always tell what they are thinking. Dogs that are unstable have to be told with growls and sometimes physical control how to behave. But just like people, not all dogs have the same ideas about how to behave. The aggressive and insecure Dachshund is not a leader and is being defensive. That is not acceptable behavior, and even another fearful dog will react by correcting it, I've witnessed this with my dog even though mine is often the fearful aggressive one in most groups. Tango on the other hand sounds more like a leader and is corrective or controlling more than aggressive. It's just a guess and an example since I didn't witness any of it, but my dog is much more likely to follow around a dog that is in control and sometimes has to use corrections, where he will attack a dog that is out of control, even if the humans think that dog is happy. (Although he's met enough dogs that don't listen to his warnings to leave him alone that he pretty much wants to attack any dog he doesn't know lately.) The thing that still amazes me is that a walk together before allowing the dogs to go nose to nose can settle Shimi enough that he can coexist with another dog when he has to. He doesn't always happily accept the other dog, but the walk stops him from going on the offensive. From time to time we have to resort to kenneling at Happy Tails, they let the dogs all roam a large room with human supervision and a large outdoor artificial turf yard, and there are large and small dog sections of the place. They have a get acquainted area where they leave the latest arrival for at least 15 minutes so they can get used to the situation, it has an iron fence so there is the ability to interact without getting hurt or overwhelmed. This seems to really help, they've never reported that he had to be separated from the group or was too aggressive to go in. I'm also sure he doesn't sleep the entire time he is there, always on guard. They have cages where they feed the dogs so that everyone is safe while they eat, and if they have to separate the dog, there is another room where they can be caged for a time out. This situation seems a little less volitile than a dog park where dogs rotate in and out constantly. We can't do the dog park anymore because the "emotions" there are just too high. I realized the other day that Shimi's aggression would be like a human walking up to another person and being greeted with "GET OUT OF MY FACE OR I'LL BEAT YOU TO DEATH RIGHT HERE!" I think it's safe to say that just about everyone would turn around and walk away, but other dogs don't do it, they just keep coming. They say that increasing domestication takes away a dog's ability to communicate with other dogs and that is the ultimate example. The one time I stopped the other dog with citronella spray, Shimi stopped snarling and just stood behind me. It took several sprays and lots of commanding the dog to go home before it decided that we weren't interesting enough to get sprayed again. What is the motivation that would make a calm dog approach a snarling whirling dervish? I've gone a little off-topic, sorry. :) I think we sometimes confuse aggression, dominance, and normal dog corrective behavior because we can’t always tell what they are thinking. Dogs that are unstable have to be told with growls and sometimes physical control how to behave. But just like people, not all dogs have the same ideas about how to behave. The aggressive and insecure Dachshund is not a leader and is being defensive. That is not acceptable behavior, and even another fearful dog will react by correcting it, I’ve witnessed this with my dog even though mine is often the fearful aggressive one in most groups. Tango on the other hand sounds more like a leader and is corrective or controlling more than aggressive. It’s just a guess and an example since I didn’t witness any of it, but my dog is much more likely to follow around a dog that is in control and sometimes has to use corrections, where he will attack a dog that is out of control, even if the humans think that dog is happy. (Although he’s met enough dogs that don’t listen to his warnings to leave him alone that he pretty much wants to attack any dog he doesn’t know lately.) The thing that still amazes me is that a walk together before allowing the dogs to go nose to nose can settle Shimi enough that he can coexist with another dog when he has to. He doesn’t always happily accept the other dog, but the walk stops him from going on the offensive. From time to time we have to resort to kenneling at Happy Tails, they let the dogs all roam a large room with human supervision and a large outdoor artificial turf yard, and there are large and small dog sections of the place. They have a get acquainted area where they leave the latest arrival for at least 15 minutes so they can get used to the situation, it has an iron fence so there is the ability to interact without getting hurt or overwhelmed. This seems to really help, they’ve never reported that he had to be separated from the group or was too aggressive to go in. I’m also sure he doesn’t sleep the entire time he is there, always on guard. They have cages where they feed the dogs so that everyone is safe while they eat, and if they have to separate the dog, there is another room where they can be caged for a time out. This situation seems a little less volitile than a dog park where dogs rotate in and out constantly. We can’t do the dog park anymore because the “emotions” there are just too high. I realized the other day that Shimi’s aggression would be like a human walking up to another person and being greeted with “GET OUT OF MY FACE OR I’LL BEAT YOU TO DEATH RIGHT HERE!” I think it’s safe to say that just about everyone would turn around and walk away, but other dogs don’t do it, they just keep coming. They say that increasing domestication takes away a dog’s ability to communicate with other dogs and that is the ultimate example. The one time I stopped the other dog with citronella spray, Shimi stopped snarling and just stood behind me. It took several sprays and lots of commanding the dog to go home before it decided that we weren’t interesting enough to get sprayed again. What is the motivation that would make a calm dog approach a snarling whirling dervish? I’ve gone a little off-topic, sorry. :)

]]> By: prajantr http://jennaandsnickers.com/2009/06/discussion-doggy-daycare/#comment-532 prajantr Fri, 05 Jun 2009 17:44:40 +0000 http://jennaandsnickers.com/?p=483#comment-532 I've never taken either Chelsea or Kaiser to doggy day care. The main reason for this is because my hubby doesn't feel it's necessary since we make a lot of time to be with them. But I've considered it. I have to admit that one of my biggest worries for Chelsea is that she just doens't like to socialize, especially not with small dogs that are frenetic and energetic. She only likes to play with big dogs if she's in the mood and most of the time she'd rather sleep in her older years. She prefers hanging out with our cat, Darren, instead. Kaiser is kind of confusing. He's shown that he plays very well with others Sometimes. For example, we have no worries when he play's with his buddy, Dakota, a Shiba owned by a good friend. :) Dakota isn't agressive really, and gets along with just about any dog. Kaiser being fairly dominant and a touch aggressive, Dakota seems to handle it just fine. A little Dachshund visitor named Epsilon is very aggressive and insecure. Upon taking a walk with Kaiser at a neutral territory park - Kaiser almost ate Epi. So at first we thought it was just that we couldn't put Kaiser with dominant aggressive dogs - but nope, Tango came over to visit and Kaiser is perfectly fine with him. Tango is a K9 artner for an NYC detective and is both dominant and aggressive as they come. So long story short - we just haven't figured out which dogs Kaiser will like versus which dogs Kaiser won't. I guess I worry very much about agression. I'm never sure how Kaiser will react and haven't got enough practice yet not to transfer my worry to Kaiser through the leash - aggravating the issue. We already know Chelsea will snap to get her space. So we figure it's just as well that Kaiser and chelsea don't go to doggy day care while we work out their socialization training. Work in progress. <abbr><em><em>prajantrs latest blog post..<a href="http://nighttrekkersguild.org/prajantr/?p=1030" rel="nofollow">Results confirmed</a></em></abbr></em> I’ve never taken either Chelsea or Kaiser to doggy day care. The main reason for this is because my hubby doesn’t feel it’s necessary since we make a lot of time to be with them.

But I’ve considered it.

I have to admit that one of my biggest worries for Chelsea is that she just doens’t like to socialize, especially not with small dogs that are frenetic and energetic. She only likes to play with big dogs if she’s in the mood and most of the time she’d rather sleep in her older years. She prefers hanging out with our cat, Darren, instead.

Kaiser is kind of confusing. He’s shown that he plays very well with others Sometimes. For example, we have no worries when he play’s with his buddy, Dakota, a Shiba owned by a good friend. :) Dakota isn’t agressive really, and gets along with just about any dog. Kaiser being fairly dominant and a touch aggressive, Dakota seems to handle it just fine. A little Dachshund visitor named Epsilon is very aggressive and insecure. Upon taking a walk with Kaiser at a neutral territory park – Kaiser almost ate Epi. So at first we thought it was just that we couldn’t put Kaiser with dominant aggressive dogs – but nope, Tango came over to visit and Kaiser is perfectly fine with him. Tango is a K9 artner for an NYC detective and is both dominant and aggressive as they come. So long story short – we just haven’t figured out which dogs Kaiser will like versus which dogs Kaiser won’t.

I guess I worry very much about agression. I’m never sure how Kaiser will react and haven’t got enough practice yet not to transfer my worry to Kaiser through the leash – aggravating the issue. We already know Chelsea will snap to get her space. So we figure it’s just as well that Kaiser and chelsea don’t go to doggy day care while we work out their socialization training. Work in progress.

prajantrs latest blog post..Results confirmed

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